Transcript
WEBVTT
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Welcome back friends.
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Do the ageless athlete podcast for your next dose of fireside chats with adventure sports, legends.
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This is Kush.
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I could deal while from my sunny window in Sanford.
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San Francisco.
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Celebrated my birthday this weekend.
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Which happily coincided with the change to daylight savings time.
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For us.
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The U S so glad for these longer days, again and more time outside.
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Share the show now with a friend.
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It helps discover us.
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Twitter for today's show where we meet with an ultra running all time.
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Great.
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Who really embodies the word ageless.
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At 60 to make an cancel.
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It is not slowing down.
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Over the past few decades, Macon has qualified and run in the us Olympic marathon trials four times.
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She has.
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Hi Meghan, would love to know How old are you?
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Where are you today?
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uh,what u have for breakfast?
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okay, I am 62 young.
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I'm in Corvallis, Oregon, and I had eggs with, rice and avocado for breakfast
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We immediately have two things in common.
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One is we are in the same time zone.
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I am just south of you in San Francisco.
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I also had eggs for breakfast
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Nice.
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I actually want to talk about something that you were just doing.
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You were in New Zealand running a famous race that I read about.
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I happened to see your blog as well.
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Really well written.
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Thank you for sharing the story.
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And one thing that immediately struck to me was that there you.
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has been, or there is this community of runners, people such as yourself who, do these ultra runs in different places.
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made me immediately think about some other outdoor communities where you have these great bonds and these great friendships.
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So maybe just starting off, can you describe a little bit of the, this culture around ultra running and, how it brings you.
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all together.
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I think you're right.
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It's a very, cohesive.
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And supportive group.
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And I would say that we all have this one thing in common and that is that we love to run and we love to run for a time and I am not afraid to reach out to Any ultra runner that haven't met if I'm going to city and just connecting and say, Hey, would you like to take me on a long run and I'll go run for eight hours with a you know, a stranger, because there's a certain, faith and expectation that they're not going to be a serial killer.
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and I met, a lot of people that way, not only in you know.
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That sort of situation, but in races are so long and there's such an ebb and flow with the runners that you could end up running with, you know, a stranger who becomes a friend because you're going to run with them for two or three hours and you just end up talking about kind of everything.
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I think it's that one common thing we have is we're going to be outside all day.
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We love to be outside.
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And then let's talk about your kids or let's talk about, you know, where you're from.
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And, I've made some friends around the world
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That sounds so beautiful and sounds like you connect with new people, sometimes strangers, because you have this, love for the shared sport, but then people that you already know well, you keep Reconnecting and keep those bonds fresh because you choose to take part in races and beautiful locations like the one that you were just in, in New Zealand, we should actually clarify for the people listening.
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Some people may not clearly understand what an ultra run is.
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I think most of us know what a marathon is.
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what is an ultra
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So technically anything over 26.
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2 miles.
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So, um, typically, um, typically in the U.
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S., the, there's four basic distances.
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That's 50K.
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50 mile, 100K, and 100 mile, and as our sport has grown, um, internationally, um, if you go to Europe or if you go any place besides the US, people who do, who use metric, they're mostly, you know, every, all the races are in kilometers, um, and also More and more races aren't a specific, you know, a traditional distance because I think we're leaning towards somewhere in the ballpark of 160K, but if a loop is 170K, then we're going to run 170K.
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So it's a little more organic that way.
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And I kind of like that gives it more purpose to an actual route, but those are the more common distances.
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And now there are even longer runs.
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There's been a recent uptick in the number of 200 mile ultras, and those are more, um, I would say akin to fast packing.
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I haven't done one, so I, I don't want to,
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Yeah.
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you know, put too much, uh, description to it, but they take a lot longer than, say, twice a 200, twice a 100 mile run, um, and they're they're structured a little bit differently.
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There are aid stations, but, Um, you know, runners can take little dirt naps along the way if they want, just on the side of the trail.
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Um, so those are getting popular.
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Um, and then there are stage races as well.
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Uh, I think the most famous one is Marathon to Saab, is a, uh, six day stage race, and there's five.
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Um, legs to it basically, um, and those are, they're each section, each day is timed and then the clock stops when you stop and your time is accumulated over those days
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Starting from anything over 26.
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2 miles to sound like almost limitless to whatever, one's imagination or Capacity endure might be one thing.
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I immediately love about how you described it how The exact length doesn't have to be a specific number.
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So yeah, you have these arbitrary, titles, let's say it's a hundred K or a hundred mile run or one 60 K.
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But really sounds like the actual course has as much weight in determining how long the run is.
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So for example, if a run is maybe connecting two trail systems together.
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And that might be a determinant to how long the.
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actual race, maybe.
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And I think that that's beautiful because I like how our niche spooks, they refuse to conform to say an arbitrary number.
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Let's say the length of a basketball court.
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Nothing wrong with basketball.
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Or the size of a Dennis gourd.
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It's determined in so many.
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Ways by mother nature and what she offers to us.
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There, there's um, one sort of caveat to that is there are road Ultra marathons, and those are, um, a different sort of beast.
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They're not quite as popular because they are harder on your body.
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Um, They're faster, and that's only, um, avenue that you can actually set a time on that is measured and stated down, and you know, the International Association of Ultra Running will have your world records, um, for different distances.
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It can only be on a course that's measurable, and I mean, you can measure a trail, but you're going to get a different measurement every time.
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So tried.
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So there's, uh, there are records for the 50k road, 50 road, 100k road, 100 mile road.
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Um, I don't think they'd go above that at this point.
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Then there's also 24 hour and 48 hour and more events.
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And in the 24 hour you can also set.
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records for, you know, how much distance has been covered
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Got it.
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It sounds like, yes, there are all these, different types of ultra runs, but there is maybe a core distinction between road or let's say a man made ultra run versus.
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A, uh, ultra trail run, which takes course.
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let's say natural features.
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Appreciate that, uh, that distinction.
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I'm guessing for the ones where people can set records.
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And I know that I think you have also set records because I think you've also had a long career with, these road races, with the US team and others.
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Does ever climate conditions or things such as, any hills you might have to run over, like, uh, change in gradient.
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Does that also take place?
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I'm trying to see.
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different, uh, road ultra runs, one takes on a flat road versus one, which might include the hills of San Francisco are being measured the same way
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They're measured the same, but it's, trying to set a world record at Boston Marathon, probably not going to happen, even though it is record eligible.
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so if you want to set a record, the best thing you should do is go to someplace where it's 55 degrees Fahrenheit and completely flat and no wind.
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And that's not easy to do.
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So, um.
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That's why some records do take a while to fall
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between all these different types of ultra runs.
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What is your favorite type?
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If there was only one kind of, I guess, I don't know, this might be a silly question, but if there's only one kind of an ultra run that you could do, how long would it be?
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Where would it be?
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And what would make it so special
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Um, for me, my favorite ultra is Western States 100 mile.
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and it's all trail.
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It's point to point.
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It's very historical.
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It was my first hundred mile run.
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and I, I love the Sierra Nevadas.
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I love.
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All the canyons.
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I love how the terrain changes from the down to, um, almost down to the valley floor.
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Um, I mean, it's just so diverse and, and so beautiful to me.
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Um, and I've sort of built my own personal community by doing that race multiple times.
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And I did live down there for eight years.
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so the whole, the story that is not just the race, but the story of living there and training there and just sort of living in, on that trail, um, it really spoke to me and I was really lucky to be able to, to be there, but that is definitely my favorite.
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I, I choose trail over road any day.
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And.
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I say a hundred miles is my favorite distance, by golly mile 80, I'm sort of always, you know, questioning my life choices.
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But I'm always happy when I finish.
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When you're deep in that type two, uh, uh,
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Mm-Hmm?
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guess one can really fathom what one might be feeling.
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Until one is actually in the middle of that and at that point, one is, uh, one is too late, but hey, you know, some, you're able to keep going.
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And, uh, one other thing before I forget, which also struck a little chord is you mentioned how community is so strong and there's.
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know, deep, deep sense of passion where you could be in a new place and you could reach into the community and find another, uh, running zealot join you for like an eight hour or so push.
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And I find that is such a great parallel with another, let's say, outdoor sport like rock climbing where, where, I could be visiting, for example, recently I was in, in Peru, in Juarez, and I needed a climbing partner there, and I just reached, reached, And I was able to get somebody who's, and we spent the next three days climbing together in the mountains and, you know, from being complete strangers, you know, one is literally holding the rope and trusting the other person with their lives.
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And then as you do that, you start sharing all these.
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Beautiful things, your life story, it's kind of a combination of, uh, putting your life in somebody else's hands.
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And maybe sharing an overnight Greyhound ride where you.
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divulge, all your dirty secrets with yeah.
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The person.
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Yeah.
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No, I agree.
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It's, it's very similar to that.
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trusting somebody to take you running through mountains that you've never been.
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you're putting your life in their hands, just like maybe not quite as on the edge as rock climbing, but yeah, very similar.
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Um, just, uh, and it's for me with somebody were to come to Corvallis and ask me to take them for a run.
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I would love that.
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I would love to show them my backyard.
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So incredible how you would share some of your most treasured backyard trails with a new person and you would actually find joy in that shared experience.
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A little bit about your background.
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Where did you grow up, Meghan?
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And, uh, Were you a natural athlete growing up?
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Were there runners in the family and you would run with them?
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And then, yeah, how did you go from whatever you were doing as a kid to, uh, running 100 mile races?
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I grew up in rural Oregon.
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my parents were educators and we had a hobby farm and I know I spent a lot of time driving a tractor around in circles.
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and it never seemed to, you know, bore me.
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So I think is just, An innate ability to just keep going, not done yet, just got to keep going.
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And the other piece was I would look at the, the hills to the west of our little farm, and I've always want to know what's on the other side.
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I really wanted to just get on a horse and ride over those hills, but you know, it was somebody else's property, never did it, but, um.
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I've always had that curiosity and that desire and basically travel bug.
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Um, according to my brother, I was a pretty good athlete because he once said, well, I was never the athlete that you are.
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Oh, Um, I did ball sports in high school.
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It was much as such a small school that everybody did everything.
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So I was lucky to be able to play volleyball, basketball.
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I ran track, but I wasn't.
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That good because I wanted to do, like most kids I wanted to do, you know, I want to jump the hurdles and stuff.
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Um, I didn't really do any distance until I was in my twenties and I just, I like to be fit.
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I don't I don't really want to sit around and not be fit.
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So I started running because that was the most convenient thing And over time I just sort of became addicted that.
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And I'll start with a 5k.
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Oh, that's pretty fun.
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Let's do a and just.
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It's sort of a natural progression.
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I took a long time.
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I was never in a hurry.
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I never really envisioned myself You know, I was a pretty good marathoner never really saw that coming and then started Yeah, I just it just evolved.
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It wasn't I never I look back, you know 50 years ago This life I could not imagined
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Was it a conscious decision to transition from running shorter races and marathons, let's say, into doing these longer, uh, monstrous runs?
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was it gradual?
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Or, and then once you, once you start doing.
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These super long runs.
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what convinced you that this was, you know, I don't know, maybe what you were born to do?
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I'm curious.
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So I just kept you know, try the next thing.
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Cause it looked fun.
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Like, look at those people.
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They look totally destroyed.
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They just ran 50 miles.
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I want to do that too.
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and I did see, um, one of the older documentaries on Western States.
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And that was like, I really want to do that.
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I want to see this for myself.
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I want to experience for myself.
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Yeah, people are totally wrecked, but um, let me have a taste of that too.
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you know, they are really kind of ridiculously hard and It's like giving birth, you know, when you're done, you're like, yay, I have this baby.
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Now I'm going to go do it again because it wasn't all that bad.
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the people I know who have given birth and some of them have given birth, uh, you know, more than once like my mom, I don't think they seek out more occasions to give birth.
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So I'm sure it's just as hard.
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but something about, uh, these races keeps calling you back despite, uh, uh, you know, the, the depth of, uh, suffering and hard work that it takes.
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You, you use the word curiosity, which is quite interesting.
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What is that curiosity for?
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Is it for figuring out what you're capable of?
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Is it curiosity for knowing if you're better than other people?
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What is that, uh, force for you?
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think it's mostly curiosity about what I'm capable of, um, because it changes.
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And so I, you know, I, I peaked, I peaked in my fifties, which is nice that I waited that long to peak.
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Um, so now the curiosity is more about.
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At what rate am I going to keep slowing down and, uh, what can I, are there things I can do to Slow down the slow down.
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Um, and can I keep enjoying it?
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it's it's a little more of a challenge physically, um, to enjoy it because the amount of work, for one thing, I can't do the amount of work and the amount of work isn't as quite as fun as it used to be.
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It used to be, you know, you go to the track.
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Do a hard workout and you, you know, you see your splits and you're like pretty jazzed because you've either had a great workout and you're a little bit faster or you're kind of the same, but it feels so good.
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And now I haven't been to the track in a while because it's so discouraging, but I worked so hard and, um.
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Yeah, it's it's not as rewarding for sure.
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Um, so that's, you know, kind of where I am now is just trying stay curious enough to keep myself and, you know, make some data points for Um, Other people to,
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Absolutely.
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What, maybe what brings you curiosity and joy today could be a little bit different than what it was in your fifties a few years ago.
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And it could be different yet from what it might've been when you were, uh, maybe, uh, more of a swashbuckling spring chicken, if you may, running all these races, winning all these races.
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So this question I have, which.
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Which, uh, comes from our common friend, Carling, Carling Ursim.
00:21:07.787 --> 00:21:15.356
And Carling wants to know, you have been running for such a long time all kinds of life phases.
00:21:17.044 --> 00:21:19.433
have you kept your stoke up?
00:21:20.108 --> 00:21:22.999
it hasn't been hard until the last few years.
00:21:23.019 --> 00:21:23.628
Honestly.
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I, I'm not sure.
00:21:26.689 --> 00:21:30.638
I know I had a, I had some struggles very early on with motivation.
00:21:32.148 --> 00:21:33.868
but there were there were few and far between.
00:21:33.868 --> 00:21:35.249
I think I would get to this point.
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Like, if I just like, Oh, I don't know if I really want to train or run.
00:21:38.378 --> 00:21:42.219
And then I would think about how it's sort of like the Nike just do it.
00:21:42.239 --> 00:21:44.749
It, I know that if I go out and do it.
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I'll glad I did it.
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And I, that's still true.
